Emerson's Marris Gold

[Richee]

I was in my local Emerson's retailer the other day looking for Marris Gold. They told me they don't make it any more due to a process issue??. Is this true? I bought all their stock of APA's instead!!

Richee

[Kieran Haslett-Moore]

I dont know about that, but it has certainly suffered in recent times I suspect due to the switch to NZ malt.

[Hopfull]

Hi I'm new to this forum but I couldn't help replying to your comment Kieran on NZ Malt. I've seen it mentioned a few places about our brewers making beer with NZ malt being detrimental compared to the UK stuff. Orginally our beers were brewed with Canterbury Maltings Ale malts until the plant closed down, the re-emergence of the NZ Malt from Canterbury has enabled us to filfull our philosophy of supporting local industries & reducing our "fuel-miles"
You might "knock" the NZ malt but it has really 'lifted' the flavour of the Bookbinder in the last 6 months, it takes time to re-adjust to a new malt source. The Pale Ale & Organic Malts are lovely clean tasting with crispiness that really suits our recipes. We use a more intensive mashing regime in our brewhouse but the results are worth it!

[Barry]

Can it be bought at homebrewer volumes? From where? And can you give more details on the mashing regime please Hopfull? Are we talking longer rests or more steps? Intrigued.

[Stu McKinlay]

I certainly agree that the changes cannot be put down to the malt alone. The brewer's job is to work with the new ingredient to re-create the old beer, or just throw caution to the wind and create something new. The Bookbinder changes were subtle, except to us that drink it regularaly and know what we are tasting. The Brewski changes could have been picked by anyone.

On the whole, however, I agree with Kieran. No beer I've tasted, with full knowledge of it changing to NZ malt has improved. Most of them I've noticed a decline in before I've heard they have changed. Some I've only guessed have changed (e.g. Brewski). Bookbinder is certainly on the way back, and has always been a bit of a 'go to' pint for me, but it has been a long transition. I am, however, only one customer (and probably not a lucrative one at that!)

The Twisted Hop seem to have made the best transition. The last two pints of Golding I had were before and after I'd heard about the change. The first few sips, of the first pint, seemed a little light in malt richness and a little under-attenuated, but I was enjoying it by the bottom of the pint. The second pint, once I knew, was good from top to bottom. No complaints there.

I'd love to see Gladfield do so well that there is even demand for a second maltings. I'm all for local ingredients, if the quality and price is good. I'd also like to try it at home but I'm not sure yet that we can muster a big enough order...

Cheers
Stu

[Kieran Haslett-Moore]

I think philosophically the gladfield malt is fantastic, I however cant help but feel most beers I have tried that have swapped over have displayed detrimental changes. I have had conversations with Colin Paige where he has displayed the oppersite view.

As with Stu, I would not be a lucritive customer.

[Stu McKinlay]

Opposite view on the philosophy or the changes to the beers?

[Kieran Haslett-Moore]

He seemed to think that when Richard swapped to the nz malt he solved alot of the dms problems that he apparently had been having.

[Hopfull]

When I first started out I was using NZ malts as much as I could - my philosophy being to brew world class beer using NZ ingredients - I beleive Emersons is doing that. We've now using fantastic organic lager malts and ale malt from Canterbury that I think gives better FLAVOUR for the beers that we brew - now, here's the catch..... Not every mash regime/yeast strain/water profile/hop choice will suit this malt ! Fortunately we've found the right combinations and they work. Its about understanding how your malt works with yeast, water and hops. I could give you the bookbinder recipe to brew in Wellington, Hawkes Bay and Auckland on different plants, using your house yeasts and your 'pale malt' and it would not taste like Bookie! We still use Euro malts and plenty of them I might add in a number of our beers that suit the malt profiles of various Euro malts, yeast and hop combinations. The comment above re dms is a classic example of maybe how our yeast was performing with some of the Euro malt - some of the pale malt we were using significantly changed in profile across the last couple of years - malt is a natural agricultural grain - its profile is affected by growing season similarly to grapes and which year/vintage they were harvested.

[Barry]

"I could give you the bookbinder recipe to brew"

Now thats just plain cruel - teasing us so.
Still interested to hear how the mash schedule has changed, more steps or just a longer (single) rest?
Stu, how many kgs is a minimum order for Gladfield malts?

[Hopfull]

The minimum size is 30kg with choice of Pale Ale or Lager. Bio-Pilsner is in short supply until new season barley is in, just praying for the good weather!!

[Kieran Haslett-Moore]

30kg? thats nothing, do you mean 300kg?