What are you brewing?

[nzbrewer]

Since this is the most popular thread on the RealBeer.co.nz forum I thought I would start it here just to see what happens

[Martin Bridges]

Ah, no worries. My plan is to dry hop once, then adjust the second dry-hop once I see how the first one has gone. Don't worry, in the unlikely event of me winning I'll reveal all.

[Raph]

I'm thinking of experimenting a little with Extracts;

A medium to dark Malt extract
Treacle
No Hops

I'm not sure about the treacle though, cause I know sucrose gives the beer a 'yeasty' flavour, but i'm not sure about treacle, nor brown sugar for that matter...

[Ally Mcg]

No hops?

I'm no expert, but you need something in there to balance the residual sweetness from the unfermentable sugars, which won't be inconsiderable if you're using treacle and Med/Dark ME, otherwise you'll just have sickly sweet alcohol unless thats your aim, in which case, good luck.

I'd do some googling and see what other people have done sans hops, if its recommended etc. My 12c suggestion would be to use some historical throwback (bog myrtle, heather, spices (cinnamon, coriander, star anise, flowers, rimu, mauka etc etc)).

It'd be good to know what the hypothesis of the experiment is to be able to offer you some more advice re no hops. If its different extracts why not try LME versus a darker one in the same (hopped) beer? Adjuncts, then brew the same beer with golden syrup and treacle. No hops, well, see above.
Happy brewing

[Tony]

Hi Raph. Welcome mate. I am not sure what your experience is, but Ally has a point. No hops and it will taste awful, if I may say so. May I suggest, you start experimenting with some extract home brew kits? Go down to your local home brew store, pick a style you like, replace the sugar with another LME (liquid malt extract) and go from there. The brew kits, have malt extract, some hops, yeast and everything included. It does say on the back of the can to add 1 kg of sugar, as I suggest, replace that with a malt of your choice and see where it goes?

You can experiment with whatever adjuncts you choose, from there. But mate, start simple and go for gold.IMHO

[denimglen]

I'd stay away from anything that's not light malt extract - the results from steeping grains with light ME is much more satisfying, adaptable, and flavourful for only a little more effort.

I wouldn't really use much treacle either, it's kinda finicky in that only a little won't give you much and a little too much is overpowering and sickly. Definitely worth a shot down the line but I wouldn't fuss over it too much, it's not that great of an adjunct.

You'll need something to bitter to balance out sweetness, whether it's a historical throwback like mentioned above or hops you'll need something in there. If you're trying to avoid hop flavour or aroma then go without late kettle additions, a 60 minute hop addition won't add much in the flavour or aroma department.

Are you just beginning brewing and want a recipe to learn ingredients? I'm sure someone here can recommend something very simple to start out and get a feel for what adds what to a beer.

[Raph]

Ok, my experience is 1 wheat beer (black rock i think), 1 Munton's stout, 1 cider and 2 Kilju (finish sugar wine(was for friends not ymself)).

So the hops were already boiled into the kits then? cause thats my main issue, I've read a little on when to put hops in but getting a kettle or something to boil it in is difficult cause i'm not sure how big a container I will need for it (and what i've read has been from american sites which doesn't help with the changeover from Gallons to Litres).

The main aim of my experiments is really to see how different flavours react really. I want to make a beer with high mouthfeel (ideally creamy) which isn't too bitter and not as dark as a stout. In my mind something like a scotch ale but creamy. I'm rather new to brewing so all your advice is really helpful :)

[Barry]

right, cool.
so the difference between a "kit" and extract, is that a kit is condensed "wort" - that is malt that has been boiled with hops to contribute bitterness, then condensed and canned.

Extract is just condensed malt. It's all sugary sweetness so therefore needs a bitterness contribution (hops) to make the resulting beer balanced and drinkable.

If you're doing kits, keep doing what you're doing. Most kits are on the sweet/malty side of things so you won't get a lot of hop character or bitterness. Should be perfect to your taste.

If you're using extract you'll need to add water to your extract to make up your total wort quantity, then boil that and add hops for bitterness. Hop alpha acids need to be boiled to absorb into the wort (the acids are isomerised in the boil).

[denimglen]

Barry's on to it.

Conversion from gallons to L is pretty easy, about 3.8L in a US gallon.

A lot of people start out doing partial boils, ie a boil smaller than the overall batch size, in this boil you add unhopped malt extract and hops.

To add that creaminess you need unfermentable sugars basically - long chain sugars that cannot be fermented by yeast to alcohol so stay in the finished beer. I'd experiment with adding things such as maltodextrin powder and lactose to kit beers, these will increase body/mouthfeel. Lactose will also increase sweetness, I think the rule of thumb is weight for weight lactose is about half as sweet as normal table sugar. Further down the track when you start mash brewing you can also look at adding things such as oats and flaked barley.

Also instead of adding the kilo of dextrose/table sugar called for on the can, swap it out for a kilo of (unhopped) liquid malt extract, this will also help you on your way to a beer with more mouthfeel. Simple sugars like dextrose/sucrose are fully fermentable so leave you with nothing but alcohol, whereas adding malt extract will yield less alcohol but more unfermentable sugars and more flavour compounds. I'd also use a sachet of Safale US-05 instead of the yeast provided with the kit.

By the sounds of things I'd be looking at things like kits for amber ales or brown ales, which should get you somewhere similar to a scotch ale. Brew one and see what you think it needs, then come back to us and we can help you out a bit more, unfortunately the road to the perfect recipe is a very long one.

I would really recommend www.howtobrew.com, it is THE bible for beginning brewers.

[Raph]

Cheers, I'll have a look at that!

[Mike Neilson]

WBC IPA Competition

Ok heres my final recipe all measured and weighed out and yeast all ready to rock and roll for tomorrow!!

WestCoast IPA

5.55kg Pale Malt UK
1.00 kg Caramel/Crystal Malt (30.0 EBC)

17.00 gm Columbus (90 min)
17.00 gm Simcoe (90 min)

10.00 gm Simcoe(60 min)
10.00 gm Columbus (60 min)

27.00 gm Columbus (15 min)
27.00 gm Simcoe (15 mins)

37.00 gm Cascade (10 min)
37.00 gm Centennial (10 min)

16.00 gm Columbus (0 min)
16.00 gm Centennial (0 min)
16.00 gm Cascade (0 min)
16.00 gm Columbus (0 min)
16.00 gm Simcoe (0 min)

30.00 gm Cascade (Dry Hop 10 days)
30.00 gm Centennial (Dry Hop 10 days)
30.00 gm Columbus (Dry Hop 10 days)
30.00 gm Simcoe (Dry Hop 10 days)

67 Degree Mash
Wlp001

1.070
100IBU

Nice and Simple Malt with layers and Layers of US Hops!!

[Simon David kelly]

Did a pils on the weekend ...

3.50 kg Pilsner
0.56 kg Munich
0.56 kg Vienna

BIAB mash @ 68°C for 90 minutes

15 minute boil prior to additions.

60 min 49.00 gm Hallertauer
10 min 28.00 gm Hallertauer
10 min 1.00 tsp Irish Moss

wyeast 2124 bohemian pilsner

OG 1.046

planned for a 1.045 in beersmith. very please with the BIAB method.

[Alelover]

OK, commissioned the kit on Sunday, reasonably successful. Just a few issues with my pump (which is a washing machine pump which collapsed a bearing). Anyway the brew was:
8.5kg Gladfield Ale
1kg Wheat
1kg Carared
80g Green bullet at start of the boil

30g Goldings for 40mins
10g Goldings for 20mins
I intend to dry hop with a few Goldings
Yeast from Wigram, but not sure which strain!

All bubbling nicely in the fermenter at 20deg.

I plan to bottle and prime some with dextrose and some with spray malt to see which turns out he best.